View Issue Details
| ID | Project | Category | View Status | Date Submitted | Last Update |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 0009867 | MMW v4 | DLNA/UPnP | public | 2012-10-22 15:54 | 2013-05-05 22:38 |
| Reporter | lowlander | Assigned To | |||
| Priority | urgent | Severity | minor | Reproducibility | always |
| Status | closed | Resolution | fixed | ||
| Product Version | 4.0.7 | ||||
| Target Version | 4.1 | Fixed in Version | 4.1 | ||
| Summary | 0009867: Changes to media server hierarchy / sorting | ||||
| Description | When opening an Artist over DLNA MediaMonkey will list both the Albums and Files which is consistent with MediaMonkey, but is not done by other DLNA servers and could result in a slow loading of Artists over DLNA. For some this may be a good thing (you get a list of all tracks by the Artist) it proves to slow down things a lot for others. Ideally it would be an option allowing the user to choose the behavior. | ||||
| Steps To Reproduce | Note: An additional issue is with Files set to the Artist, but without Album. | ||||
| Additional Information | http://www.mediamonkey.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=67792 http://www.mediamonkey.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=349804#p349804 | ||||
| Tags | No tags attached. | ||||
| Fixed in build | 1620 | ||||
| related to | 0008740 | closed | Ludek | Basic Collection sub-node customization |
| related to | 0009264 | closed | Ludek | Media Sharing of custom nodes needed |
| related to | 0010405 | closed | Ludek | Browse 'Title' folder is sorted incorrectly |
| parent of | 0010563 | closed | Ludek | Title node shown over UPnP/DLNA when not enabled in Collection |
| related to | 0010423 | new | Ludek | Improved representation of Classical music over DLNA |
| related to | 0011792 | closed | Ludek | Make DLNA server custom sort capable |
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Perhaps the default behaviour over DLNA should be that any folder containing subfolders should display tracks within Folder within a new 'All x' folder if their are > 100 tracks in the folder. i.e. Folder 1 - All <Folder1> - Subfolder1 - Subfolder2 - .... e.g. Genres > Rock - All 'Rock' - Beatles - Lemonheads e.g.2 Artist>The Beatles - All 'The Beatles' - Help - Revolver - Yellow Submarine |
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Actually I wanted to enter the same issue just now, it makes also problems for Soundbridge (ticket MFB-492853). The problem is that MM servers both albums and files when navigating/searching for album artist. The first 3 items are albums, but Soundbridge is confused by the tracks and repeatedly sends the same new requests for albums of the album artist. |
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Fixed in build 1620. I haven't added the 'all' node suggested by Rusty, because as I noted above, DLNA clients expect only albums as sub-containers of album artist and are confused otherwise and potentially fails to read the content properly (like the Soundbridge). In addition it seems that all the others media servers list only albums on that level. |
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Note that this was raised on Artist where not showing tracks could be a problem as some tracks of the Artist may not have Album. However navigation speed of DLNA is a big issue so I think that Rusty's suggestion may solve this with the addition of Unknown (for all files that have no value for the nodes subfolders. So you would see: Artist - All - Album 1 - Album 2 - Album n - Unknown (ie. all tracks of Artist without Album value) I'd suggest that All and Unknown to be an option the user can enable (independently). If the option is to be implemented (it really should) it should be considered to make the hiding of tracks itself optional (ie. an option between standard MMW behavior (as was implemented) and standard DLNA behavior). Some issues that need to be considered: 1) Should All and/or Unknown be shown if no sub-nodes exist for node (ie. an Artist that has tracks, but no Album tags assigned). 2) Should All be extended to Playlists where there are nested Playlists? (setting up sync options in MMA can be very slow due to tracks being loaded in a parent Playlist when trying to see child Playlists). |
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Note that it is not about speed only, see my notes 0009867:0034443, 0009867:0034442 . Some clients fail to read albums of an artist completely if they are served in a non-standard way. Also I don't know any server that serves the items like you suggested. |
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Re-opened: Based on IM discussion with Rusty we concluded that (some) DLNA clients probably just don't like mix of folders and files on the same level, so I will add the "All" folder for tracks of artist/genre and we will see |
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In general, MM should probably display over UPnP, the nodes that are configured by the user to display in the tree, however, the manner in which the nodes display (i.e. hierarchy and sort order) should be hardcoded to avoid several current problems: a) some UPnP clients have trouble displaying a combination of folders and tracks. b) content published over UPnP doesn't have much metadata included with it, so complex sorts that make sense in MMW, appear non-sensical in a UPnP client as the user can't understand the logic of the sort. c) sorts that are made by a user in MM are often transient (e.g. temporarily sort Music node by rating), and therefore 'ruin' the presentation of data over UPnP. In the future, we can allow this to be configurable, but in the short term, hardcoded sorts would be an improvement. 1) 'All' node at the top level of any Collection: - tracks aren't sorted alphabetically by title (sort order is impossible to discern). See 0010405. - most libraries will have too much content for such a node to be useful so an addition, if an 'All' node has e.g. > 10,000 entries it might be a good idea for MM to automatically break the titles up by Letter or Letter pairs (e.g. ab / cd / ef / ...) 2) 'Location' node: Note that clients that can't process files/folders in the same directory will have problems with Location subnodes, but I don't think there's anything we can do about this. 3) 'Artist&Album Artist' node: - if we only display Albums within this node, then i) some tracks (those that are by the Artist, but not by the Album Artist) will not appear ii) users won't be able to quickly play all tracks by the Artist Consequently: the suggestion raised earlier of having an 'All' node that contains tracks by both the 'Artist' and the 'Album Artist' might make most sense. 'Artists' node: - Same approach as above. i.e. for each <Artist> have an 'All' subnode, followed by the relevant Albums. 'Album Artists' node: - Same approach as aoove. i.e. for each <Album Artist> have an 'All' subnode, followed by the relevant Albums. 3) Composer node: Currently each <Composer> displays each <Album> contained within followed by individual tracks. This can be problematic e.g. for a composer such as beethoven whichh may have hundreds of Albums, and thousands fo tracks. As suggested above, it should instead: - Display <All> (containing all tracks by the composer) - Display each <Artist> each containing 'All' + indivdual 'Album' representations, each 'Album' containing individual tracks 4) Genre node: Currently each <Genre> displays each <Artist> contained within followed by individual tracks. This is problematic because of the number of tracks. As suggested above, it should instead: - Display <All> (containing all tracks in the <Genre>) - Display each <Artist> each containing 'All' + indivdual 'Album' representations, each 'Album' containing individual tracks |
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Sounds good to me. Especially sorting has been a sore point for many. |
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Re: 1) As discussed over IM, we can make the Title node visible by default for each collection. It allows users to browse by letter, e.g. Music->Title->F-> to show all F* tracks. |
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Implemented in 1620, just the new Composer hierarchy remains to add. But I am unsure about the new composer hierarchy, I think that mostly Artist = Composer which would look oddly. In other cases I think that Artist is often not the key. I think that probably most of classical songs has album well known, but artist unknown. If any, I would rather use Conductor instead of Artist? But sounds to me as low priority issue. |
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Re. composer you're partially right: - Some more serious users would want to then browse by conductor - Some more serious users would want to then browse by artist (which they use to indicate the performer) - Some users would want to then browse by album One possibility would be to show the following at the <composer> level: - Artists - Conductors - <Album 1> - <Album 2> - <Album 3> ... |
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The Composer is now traced as 0010423 |
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1) User should be able to disable the Title node (eg. if Collection doesn't have Title enabled it shouldn't show over UPnP either). Although the All node may lack usefulness when displaying large amounts of tracks it should be up the user to enable/disable Title. (http://www.mediamonkey.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=70352) EDIT by Ludek: Tracked as 0010563 |
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Verified 1636 |
